Objectively Transparent Headlines
Some fall colours for you. Say, do you think I can eat THOSE berries?
Enjoy that sunshine, Edmonton.
It’s nice to see all that blue sky. Maybe we’ll get a taste of some lovely fall weather after all. Maybe…
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Last night was the Ward 7 candidates forum. That’s TonCat’s ward (Tony Caterina), and he’s facing four other people. The two main competitors are Brendan Van Alstine, who’s been campaigning since last year and is a recognized community volunteer, and Scott McKeen, the Edmonton Journal columnist.
Now, today’s Sun story says this: Ex-columnist taken to task for NIMBY column but I don’t think he’s an EX-columnist if he still works for the Journal. They may re-assign him if he loses the election but that’s not known at this point.
I think he should have quit before running. Or the Journal should have cut him loose.
Here’s why:
The Journal, like most newsrooms, stands firmly in the journalism camp of “Objectivity.” We, here at the edmontonian, don’t really think there’s much of that in news, and stand in the camp of “Transparency.”
But, because the Journal thinks its news coverage is objective it shouldn’t have a council candidate on staff. It’s for the same reason they don’t have regular columns from politicians and government staff.
(In a bit of cut-throat business, Postmedia is laying people off and offering buyouts, it’s the perfect opportunity to save some cash for the Journal.)
If they could just admit that choosing what gets covered, how much coverage it gets, who they talk to for quotes, how they lay out the paper, what stories they ignore, and a bunch more stuff actually makes their news coverage subjective they could keep McKeen on staff.
Instead, we have to look back at (at least) his last few columns and wonder if he was already thinking of running, or had been approached. It just makes the Journal look bad.
Now, I should note, I like McKeen as a candidate. He’s smart, funny, and seems to have a lot of the same urban values I want to see in my Edmonton. He and Van Alstine are fine choices for Ward 7. This is just about the journalism stuff. I have the same opinion for news folk jumping into PR or media relations without missing a beat, especially to work for government or politicians.
As for former Edmonton Sun columnist Kerry Diotte running in Ward 11, he hasn’t work at the paper for a year so I think he’s just fine and dandy.
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Let’s see what else is happening in the election today… (more…)
Spam, spam, spam, egg, and spam
We love hearing from you.
We love having conversations with you in the comments of our various posts even more.
But we do have a little comment moderating going on. So, if you’re new to the place, let us know if you’ve dropped in a comment and it isn’t showing up.
First-time comments are always held for moderation (this includes posting with a different e-mail address).
Comments with multiple links (Derjis knows what I’m talking about) are also held. We also have filters on a bunch of dirty words (like porn, Gregg) so even if we write a story about something sexy and you want to say something sexy it might be held. Just drop us an e-mail or tweet to ask (politely) where the hell your comment is and why we’re censoring you.
If you do comment and find it’s not appearing, it’s probably for one of those reasons mentioned.
We get a lot of spam. While we do try to look through all of the “pending” comments for real ones, we’re sure to miss one eventually. So let us know if your thoughts aren’t showing up.
Then you can comment about how awful we are at moderating comments.
Ask more questions
While that headline could be taken in a philosophical manner, it shouldn’t be.
Nope. We’ve just added a handy “click here for e-mails when there’s a new comment,” kind of thing to our posts. Now you can comment, click to be notified of any other comments, and really be part of a conversation.
Plus, it’s really nice to be notified by e-mail of comments on something you’ve commented on because you can be lazy and not have to check back.
But I know you check back here. Like 10 times a day. Right?
RIGHT?!
Ahem. Thanks for being part of the Edmonton conversation.
I believe this image shows what I'm talking about.
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Hey, while I’ve got you here, let me be the first to officially invite you to the 1st birthday of the edmontonian and The Unknown Studio. It’s going to be Monday, August 23.
So don’t go balls-out crazy the last weekend of the Fringe. You’ll nee energy to party with us. And eat cake.
Don’t forget to help us pay for the greatest birthday gift of all. And if you come to the party you’ll get to see the gift as it happens.
Watchoo talkin’ ’bout Edmonton?
Yes, Edmonton, it’s time to dive back into that sometimes horrible, awful world of online comments.
Now, I don’t want to seem like I’m picking on the Edmonton Journal, because that was never my intention. In fact, I really want the Edmonton Journal’s comments to be a place we can all rally around as a spot to have valuable debate about city topics.
I just pointed out how their anonymous comments can knock down multiple comments of worth, with a single racist or personal attack.
One way we can help them is to sign up for the comment system, then go under the My Community tab (once you’re in “Your Account”) and activate your name. Anonymous no more you can shoot down the angry, dumb people and vote them off the island, so to speak.
The Journal being Edmonton’s most active newsroom they are my first point of reference on this. But let’s see what Edmonton’s other newsrooms offer in the ways of online connection and discussion with their audience (you and me).
The Sun doesn’t always seem to activate comments on every story. Or I’m just missing the “Comment here” button.
But when you can comment on a story you’re asked for your name and an e-mail address or your Facebook login. (See the image to the right.)
Sure, that stuff could be fake, but most people will likely enter real information and comment in a productive manner. While not moderated the comments can be removed, and if you’ve given your e-mail or Facebook info you could probably be blocked (I’m guessing that’s why they’d be asking).
And I really think that’s about all it takes. It’s going to be the rarest of trolls that will come back again and again, with fake e-mail after fake e-mail address, when they could just go somewhere without any information required.
The CBC doesn’t always allow comments. They’ve gotten into some trouble for people saying things in comments, and then being held to account for those comments on the CBC’s website.
So you probably won’t be able to comment on legal, court, crime stories.
They require you to sign up to comment.
That’s not to say signing up is the perfect way to limit trolls and stupid comments. As we learned with the St. Albert Habitat for Humanity letter, some people will gladly sign their real name to things that aren’t nice or smart. But sign-ups and moderation are BIG steps to having a worthwhile debate.
It doesn’t look like they activate comments. Or, again, I’m missing the button or tab while scanning the site.
You can, however, comment on their blog.
It appears you can comment. Whether it’s moderated isn’t clear, but since you’re to use your Facebook, Twitter or OpenID to login, they’ve probably got some tracking going on.
There doesn’t look to be a way to comment on 630 CHED stories.
You can comment on the blogs. Though, check my warning about the iNews880 blogs in case your comments don’t appear right away.
While CHED and iNews880 share a newsroom they do have different approaches to online comments.
iNews880 doesn’t let you comment on their iReports (sometimes audience-submitted stories). You can comment on their blog posts in a familiar fashion (though they go off somewhere for moderation) but they can take hours, even days to be approved. And when you comment on a story your thoughts are whisked away to a central comment area, not the story’s page. Which is weird.
Neither of these Corus newsrooms appear to ask for e-mail or ID stuff, but their comment-by-comment moderation would likely negate the need. Though, in my opinion, comments appearing quickly are more important.
Otherwise, aren’t you missing the point?
Metro’s tricky. They let you think you can comment without having an account, and then they ask for a name and e-mail address. (Look to the left.) They do have an official sign-up process too.
Again, it’s all about putting up hurdles to the lazy people that want to spew hate. There are way more of them then the hardcore trolls.
You won’t get away with posting whatever you want here, without the usual name and e-mail address for their sign-up process.
You’re required to register for SEE‘s comments. Though some people are still named “anonymous.”
I would hope that anyone asking people to register is then using that information to block idiots. Oh sure, send a nice e-mail asking for intelligent debate the first time, but be ready to turf them.
Actually, whenever we’ve sent an e-mail we never hear from them again…
It doesn’t look like you can comment on stories at Vue’s website. They encourage letters to the editor.
I checked a couple of stories and didn’t see any way to comment.
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That all said, most of the newsrooms were allowing their audience to share items via Twitter, Facebook, Digg, etc…
So, what does all mean?
I don’t know. I just wanted to see what everyone was up to.
It appears you can comment at most of the city’s news websites. Most of them require some basic information from you, which I hope is then used to block you for saying angry things.
I really don’t think you have a right to spew your vile thoughts at another website. If you want to exercise your freedom of speech you should get your own blog.
What do you take away from how comments and interaction are being done?
Where do you comment? Do you do it on a regular basis, or only when a story really grabs you?
Anonymous Anger
This guy probably love edmontonjournal.com
It’s time for our second installment of “Edmonton Journal anonymous comments make us look like the worst.”
Ugh.
Paul Band fire contained
anonymous
3:14 PM on April 21, 2010
no surprise this fire started on a native reserve…got out of control with all the somewhat empty whiskey bottles tossed in amongst the garbage
- I’ve already reported this one.
Approving Katz’s rezoning application would be a big mistake
anonymous
1:04 PM on April 20, 2010
Paula, you are fat, get a life, you want a crappy sprawled out city, go write for the Herald.
Edmonton Needs this Project and it needs it now, today, no more waiting.
- This is your response to a well-written, cogent, eloquent argument against City Council passing Katz’s zoning application? Maybe you should be the one getting a life.
So, here’s what we do, Edmonton. We all get signed-up to Canada.com’s system (It’s your standard name, e-mail, password…) and we start posting smart, informed, sarcastic comments that make those people look even worse.
Oh, and we flag them for being angry, racist, hate-filled Internet trolls and knock them right out of the comment section.
That combination of flagging stupid comments and shouting down the idiots should help keep things in order until the Journal gets better moderation, and less anonymity.
Update: After writing all that stuff up there, I went and commented on a story. That’s me at 4:59pm on April 21, 2010. Why it still says “anonymous” is beyond me. I’m just trying to help you, Edmonton Journal!
Comment on this!
I’ve been meaning to write about comments for a little while. Today, I got the extra bits of inspiration I needed to finally put fingers to keyboard.
The main push for me to write about comments is the Edmonton Journal‘s un-moderated free-for-all comment system. It’s great that they are trying to get people to register, but that doesn’t seem to be taking off.
So, I wanted to highlight a couple of truly outrageous comments, especially on fairly mundane stories, to help show those big bosses that something needs to be done.
As if all the “This comment was removed for being absolutely the stupidest/angriest/most racist thing,” wasn’t proof enough. My original inspiration also comes from people smarter and funnier than me.
Today’s extra pushes came from a neat look at Gawker’s comment system, which is more community-moderated, keeping the first-timers and one-timers (usually the angriest people) from getting much play and distracting the conversation.
The other was waiting 2+ hours for my comment to appear on an iNews880 blog. Ugh. Just don’t even bother. It’s the web and if my comment isn’t going up anytime soon I’m not even part of a real-time conversation and that’s what the Internet is supposed to help provide. If I wanted to opine and wait to see it appear I’d just write a letter to the editor.
Now…onto what this is supposed to be all about…
Edmonton vigil for Polish plane crash victims
anonymous
10:32 AM on April 13, 2010
Hyphenated Canadians are dragging this country down.
Name withheld
10:34 AM on April 12, 2010
This comment has been removed because it contains material which was deemed inappropriate.
- There were actually quite a few “inappropriate” comments. No respect for the dead I guess.
The Journal is Edmonton’s largest and most popular news source (That’s not really up for debate.), so it stands to reckon their comment section should be a big ole online water cooler – but they’ve basically got an anonymous comment system. While they’ve begun to ask people to register, that’s doesn’t really seem to be happening. So, really angry, hate-filled people are saying what they really think. Well, great. I suppose it’s sort of nice reminder about the price of democracy, but the Journal (or any other newsroom/website) doesn’t have to put up with that.
Now, over here at the edmontonian, we have neither the volume of readers, nor the amount of comments to deal with that the Journal does. This makes it easy for us to approve someone the first time they comment (which is required), since, generally speaking, angry, dumb people tend to say things that are angry and dumb right out of the gate. So far, once approved, nobody here has crossed the line.
We’ve sent a few “don’t talk like” that e-mails to first-timers, trust me. And then we never hear from the troll again. That’s what I hope for my friends at the Journal: a forced registration/held for moderation system that allows them an e-mail/URL/IP address to block stupid people.
Mandel shows support for downtown arena, LRT and Expo 2017
anonymous
4:46 PM on April 13, 2010
Who taught these rednecks how to use the internet… Go back to your double-wides.
anonymous
4:40 PM on April 13, 2010
Bunch of old people in this section who can’t see the big picture. Maybe we should build more nursing homes for you old farts instead.
- Play nice.
The super-angry people with loads of time might get another e-mail address or block their IP, but if the whole system was being moderated in some capacity the Journal’s online staffers could spend a few minutes zipping those people cease and desist style e-mails instead of having to read every. single. comment. because one (or many more) might contain hate speech or libelous accusations.
I don’t think letting people come to my site or your site and say whatever they want is a part of free speech. It’s the Internet, after all, and they can go ahead and get their own hatetank blog for that. The Journal, and hopefully all newsy websites (even this little one), should be trying to raise the level of conversation and keep discussion on track.
Now…what do you think about commenting? I open up this comment section to you, and all of your intelligent, thoughtful, hilarious insights. Keep the hate-speech for the Journal.
Slave Lake’s Jim Thunder made his voice heard
anonymous
5:07 PM on April 13, 2010
mmmmm whiskey
Letter from the Editor – Comments
My bad for not doing these letters on a regular basis. I mean, you couldn’t publish a magazine without the letter from the editor. Maybe I need to use this as an excuse to get a better phone with more calendar options…
Anyway.
Told to call someone who cares? We care.
We are pleased to see more and more commenting going on. (Even more pleasing is when it’s not just our friends coming to the website.)
It got really busy last week when a new contributor explained why he felt the City Centre Theatre was a great secret of the city. So many people had so many things to say.
We love when you interact with all of our writers. (We’d love for you to write for us, too.) Just try and remember that tearing strips off someone for expressing their opinion isn’t cool, but hilarious and logical counter-arguments are game. If we keep on point we can really learn some good stuff about other people in Edmonton.
(Selfishly, keeping on point, and limiting pure anger and flame wars, also means less time required on comment moderation.)
We also hope people can spend as much time engaging in debate when we talk about other important things, such as why political affairs need to matter in your life. Any comments?
Old stories (and comments)
So, like all websites worth their salt, we get flooded with spam.
This actually comes up when you Google "old."
But I noticed that a lot of the spam traffic was on our older posts. So I decided to take action!
I closed the comments on stories and posts older than 30 days. That’s, so far, cut the spam count way down.
What it means for you, dear friends, is that you can’t leave a comment on a story that’s been up for more than 30 calendar days. So, if you bounce around to some of our older stuff (or find yourself there through one of our links), and you want to say something on that item, just drop us an e-mail.
We’ll either get your thoughts loud and clear or post them as a comment, if you’re after that.
Until we have a vast array of interns to fetch us coffee and patrol our comments these are the sacrifices we have to make.
Sep 22, 2010 | Categories: Letter(s) from the Editor(s) | Tags: comments, intern, old, spam, stories | Comments Off